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Pro-Palestinian protests on campuses

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Affairs' started by buffyfan, Apr 28, 2024.

  1. bw19481

    bw19481 Trusted.Member

    The problem with those organizations is that the all use the same sources for this conflict, the Gaza Ministry of Health and the IDF. How does Gaza’s Ministry of Health calculate the death toll? | AP News All I am saying is that the numbers are not logical. 34000 dead. 70 percent women and children. That is a total of 23,800. IDF says they killed 14000 Hamas fighters. That alone is almost 38000. So Fine we accept those numbers. Does it make logical sense that only women and children and Hamas fighters are killed? No old men? No Civilian males? Does that make any logical sense to anyone? I am not saying that the numbers are completely inaccurate, it is just the way that they are portrayed are to make the IDF look bad and Hamas good. Also it is hard to form an accurate assessment and opinion based on false and misleading information.

    The other problem I have is that things have been reported that are verifiably untrue. Most glaring is the report of 500 dead in a hospital and half an hour later the video shows the parking lot had been hit but not the hospital itself.

    Why a low civilian casualty count should be considered a victory is that traditionally in modern warfare it is a great success. London, Dresden, Berlin, Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Vietnam and Iraq are traditional modern warfare. To those that believe that war, any war, should be limited in civilian deaths, then this is a complete win for not only Israel but the Palestinians as well. I personally think war should be ugly and not sanitized like the West has convinced itself that is what is best. If was is horrific then afterwards you do not want to go through it again. If it is clean, limited and sanitized then there is no incentive to stop fighting or to shorten the length of the war. This conflict has been going on for 80 years. Does anyone see it stopping any time soon? Hell the Palestinian sympathizers on college campuses here are saying not just 1 more October 7 but 1000 more. When does it end? How many lives will be lost in the next 80 years if things keep going the way they are? A hundred thousand? A million? 5 million? This will not end until both sides say no more killing. Unfortunately if it keeps going as it is neither side will say no more. Israel withdrew all forces 18 years ago. Did that stop anything? After this, do you think that anything will change? I can guarantee even if Hamas is completely wiped out a new organization will form or an existing one will take its place. Why is that? Because no one is being forced to stop. There are no more unconditional surrenders. If Israel started carpet bombing Gaza and the death count gets up to say a hundred thousand, then the people may say this might not have been worth it and force Hamas to surrender. If a hundred thousand dead does not make it stop them maybe 200K dead will. There is a great episode of the original Star Trek: A taste of Armageddon that perfectly shows how sanitized wars can go on for decades but the thought of real destruction, pain and agony tends to make people reconsider war as an option in the first place. Look at Germany and Japan for historical evidence of that.
     
  2. bw19481

    bw19481 Trusted.Member

    Yup. But then again these are the same people that do not realize with "From the River to the Sea" actually means.
     
  3. Lian

    Lian Friendly One

    And put sanctions on their economy. They are monsters, plain and simple.
     
    Athenea likes this.
  4. Lian

    Lian Friendly One

    Also, one's terrorists are another one's Freedom Fighters.
     
    Athenea likes this.
  5. pussycat

    pussycat Administrator Staff Member

    As he announced a succession of hearings, House Speaker Mike Johnson described his cause as countering the scourge of campus antisemitism.

    "We have to act," he said. When a journalist questioned why this stated commitment to fighting antisemitism seemed to exclude hearings into far-right groups like the Nazis holding public marches, he replied: "This is not partisan at all."


    WTF??
     
  6. buffyfan

    buffyfan Trusted.Member

    So. Most people think EVERY nation signed EVERY part of EVERY itteration of Geneva. Israel has never signed the assassination part, as an example.
     
  7. Lian

    Lian Friendly One

    Israel is a terrorist state. Its not antisemitic to say that. Also, Arabs are semitic peoples too, so Israeli are stupid to say its antisemitism to support Palestinians
     
  8. pussycat

    pussycat Administrator Staff Member

    Their signature wouldn't be worth the paper it's written on, so who cares?
     
    Lian likes this.
  9. Lian

    Lian Friendly One

    if they don't sign it, then it shouldn't be applied to them (meaning if they don't respect the laws, their enemies should be able to not respect it against them either). Fight fire with fire
     
  10. buffyfan

    buffyfan Trusted.Member

    It is actually easier to get at the Ayatollah in Iran than Netanyahu. They can try and they can fail. The reason Golda Mayer did not sign it back then was she KNEW her neighbors who signed it would not honor it and claim they had nothing to do with it.

    Fun fact. The US? Is not even a member of the International Criminal Court.
     
  11. buffyfan

    buffyfan Trusted.Member

    To get this back on track a bit. Whatever the protesters FEEL, believe, whatever? Private U is PRIVATE PROPERTY. Funny enough, State or City school? Also........ private property.

    Public University has to let people in, in places, but can remove them pretty unilaterally. When it comes to a private U? The only people they have to even HUMOR are students, staff and faculty. Not even student's parents. Now Students, Faculty and Staff? Can be removed from PU too. There is NO right to protest on PRIVATE PROPERTY. There is no right to protest on Public Private either. Think a "Business" (Private U) or a Courthouse (public U). You dont actually have a 1st Amendment right to protest IN OR ON either. 1 inch on the sidewalk? Yes.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2024
  12. Always-Learning

    Always-Learning Trusted.Member

    Netanyahu made reference to the protest on college campuses as being like those Hitler held. He made no mention that his killing off the youngest present generations, and mothers who could produce more, are being killed off at a higher rate than Hitler killed them. Israel has a right to defend it's self but not to commit genocide.

    As for the college protest... Change always starts on the campus of higher learning. That is why schools and universities are always the first target of those who seek to control the masses. They know if they remove those who are free thinkers, and not afraid to point out injustice, the rest of the people will follow. That is how every dictator has come to power.
     
    Lian likes this.
  13. buffyfan

    buffyfan Trusted.Member

    And if the arrest stats showed it was students? Maybe. But every stat shows that most of the people in these "camp outs" on colleges are people who dont go there. And, again, Private U's like Northwestern are PRIVATE PROPERTY. Public U's have the right to remove ANYONE who is not a student.
     
  14. Always-Learning

    Always-Learning Trusted.Member

    Most were students with a handful of "professional protesters" or trouble makers. The same has been true throughout history. And many times those "professional" are sent in by the camp that wants a peaceful protest to turn violent for their own cause. We saw that tactic used in recent years and it turned peaceful marches into riots. They've done the same thing in every protest as far back as time records... They tried it with Martin Luther King Jr, but King's organization developed their own police force, if you will, and those who started causing trouble were escorted away before they could get it started.

    I worry less about student protest and BLM groups than I do groups like Oath Keepers, Q, and Proud Boys who wear the R.W.D.S. patch. For those who don't know what that stands for: Right Wing Death Squad. They are very good at their work and will infiltrate any organization where they can create chaos and blame the other guy... Their goal is to cause violence... and if someone dies it's all the better for their cause.

    I've told people for a couple of years now that we were getting ready to relive the 60's. Things are so divided and it is mainly because of class warfare. I agree the colleges and universities are private property. But the protest at Columbia were peaceful till outsiders came in. The same is true in California... At Indiana University, both staff and students spent a day in peaceful protest with the same demands as all the other colleges and not one problem arose. Why? Because they aren't as new worthy as Columbia or UCLA/Berkley. And the demands students made in the 60's (demanding that the schools they paid their money to stop supporting the war efforts)... Just as they are doing with Israel today... And as they did in the 80's with much greater success at Columbia.

    Change through protest always starts on Colleges and Universities because they are the first to notice when something is wrong. The average person is to busy trying just to survive and suffers from the frog in the frying pan syndrome (turn up the heat slow enough and the frog will never jump. It will just sit there and cook). And as students return home and explain events without the media spin, other people join their cause... So while they are private property, they are also a center for public knowledge and education. And their lively hood (their students) have a right to be heard if they feel their money is supporting an unjust cause.
     
    Lian likes this.
  15. pussycat

    pussycat Administrator Staff Member

    No doubt somebody will scream this is racist or anti-semitic. It's not, it's just common sense.
    A large amount of these University's funding comes from Jewish - American benefactors. Disproportionally large considering the population demographics. Under normal circumstances, the Jewish community should be commended for their efforts in furthering higher education. But it's only human nature that they in turn expect said Universities to further the Jewish / Israeli cause, not put up with demonstrations against it. It's an inherent flaw in the capitalist system.

    It should be noted that similar demonstrations are being held at Canadian campuses - McGill, U of T, others. No stormtroopers dressed as police (as yet), no rioting, and a court injunction to disperse already thrown out as a potential Charter violation. For the moment, as long as it stays peaceful, like it or not, let them protest.
    It should also be noted that one of the groups doing the protesting is a Jewish group who are equally opposed to the genocide (word chosen deliberately) occurring in Palestine.
     
    Always-Learning and Lian like this.
  16. bw19481

    bw19481 Trusted.Member

    US universities’ foreign funders: How much do we know? (universityworldnews.com)
    Funding from Arab countries to US universities raises questions: ‘Almost always come with strings attached’ | Fox Business
     
  17. pussycat

    pussycat Administrator Staff Member

  18. Lian

    Lian Friendly One

    To be fair, if USA had signed the ICC, they'd have to give a few of their high rankings who did commit war crimes too
     
  19. Lian

    Lian Friendly One

    Students can protest there, then, as they are students there. But some Jew students like to play victim to stop palestinian students from protesting for a good cause, to stop the funding of the palestinian genocide by IDF backed by US funds
     
  20. Lian

    Lian Friendly One

    Anyway, I think most unbrainwashed people can see that Israel are NOT the good guys with their systemic targeting of civilians, women, children, hospitals and civilian infrastructure.
    Funny how USA say Russians are monsters for doing the SAME EXACT THING in Ukraine, but that because Israel is an ally, its okay for them to do the same to Palestinians