Admit it, Vote by mail is the Superior System

Yes, because most people in prison are democrats and they know it's the democrat judges and lawmakers believe
they are just "a product of their upbringing and circumstance" and their crime should be handled with extreme
leniency instead of justice.

 

I stand by the statement made. I think universal mail in ballots are illegal. That’s my opinion

 

That really didn't hold up. You still believe that lie.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...55c7fa-51cf-11eb-83e3-322644d82356_story.html

“Correction: Two months after publication of this story, the Georgia secretary of state released an audio recording of President Donald Trump’s December phone call with the state’s top elections investigator. The recording revealed that The Post misquoted Trump’s comments on the call, based on information provided by a source. Trump did not tell the investigator to ‘find the fraud’ or say she would be ‘a national hero’ if she did so. Instead, Trump urged the investigator to scrutinize ballots in Fulton County, Ga., asserting she would find ‘dishonesty’ there. He also told her that she had ‘the most important job in the country right now.' The headline and text of this story have been corrected to remove quotes misattributed to Trump."

Just goes to show that Dems don't care about the truth, just the rage. WaPo admits they misquoted Trump and that they don't have or use fact checkers. The last four years, everything out of WaPo (and any other source that reports the exact same thing, so all of Liberal Media) is in question and until proven otherwise needs to be considered based on sources lying or outright fake news made up whole cloth.

 

Your wrong and full of assumptions:
1) Actually, from a statistical standpoint, proven election fraud (with a trial, evidence and conviction) involving mail in ballots, trends towards the republican side of the spectrum. It most often occurs in primary elections and often, but not always, in swing states that are red going purple.

2) Only 5 states automatically send out absentee ballots, because their electoral system is conducted by mail (witch is their rite according to and written into the constitution). (additionally of the 5, only one has flipped, CO in 2004. The others are know reliable red and blue states and follow the same demographic profile of typical red and blue states)

3) Although it is a logical conclusion that mail in balloting is more susceptible to fraud since you are not there in person to cast the vote, however, to the contrary in person voting is much more susceptible to fraudulent activity because one only needs to convince one polling agent that they are who they say they are. Where as mail in balloting requires multiple levels of verification, most of which are conducted by machines which lack the ability to have sympathetic or emotional bias. For example, my office of elections had my name misspelled for two the last three election cycles. The polworker looked at my id and the name in the polbook, which were not the same, and simply crossed me off the list and let me go. If it had been a machine I would have had to present more information to prove my identity. To commit voter fraud at the pols one only needs to have access to the voter registration data, which is public info, and possess the knowledge and/or ability to create/ obtain some fake id's.

Of course we could also further verify and or investigate suspected acts voter fraud, but that would require higher taxes to pay for the investigators and prosecutors since it is the states responsibility. I think we all know where republicans stand on higher taxes. I guess we could also privitize it, after all what incentive would a large corporation have to throw an election?

Part of our Nation's problem is that we too easily spout off personal beliefs, automatically dismiss the opposition, and are too lazy to disprove facts that don't agree with their agenda.

 

Given that mail in envelops indicate which party the person is registered to, it's much easier for fraud to occur with mail in. All it takes is, for instance a Democrat mail carrier (as tends to be the case) to notice a bunch of envelopes with "R" on them, and then "lose" them, thus throwing the election off. A box here, a box there. And with everyone putting who they voted for or will vote for in their front yards, it'd be easy for them to tell which ones to "lose". No convincing required, as they'd already be pre-disposed to favor the candidate they support. Doesn't get easier than that.

 

So let me get this right, since you want the Voter ID on the physical ballot, you want a method of tracing a secret ballot vote back to the individual voter, correct? Im sure nothing bad could come of that.
Towards your second point; who's responsibility is it to place the Voter Id on the ballot? Is it a human or machine? If it is human and someone else accidentally flips a digit thus inadvertently places your ID on their Ballot too, does that mean that both of your voices should be censured or nuliviated? How would you know if that occured?

Isn't this more easily accomplished with a caucus rather than a pol vote. I guess that would be rather inconvenient for most and definitely more costly but why should voting be easy? you should be concerned and fearful enough to get off your ass and endure whatever it takes to vote right? worked for the civil rites movement, worked for women's suffrage movement. then again i the kind of person who believes that CEO's should stand in line with the rest of the common folk to vote, get lunch or have their representative listen to their concerns.

 

True but largely misleading. All States, and to an extent local Governments, have the rite to design a ballot and a system of their choosing. it is explicitly stated in the constitution ( this goes towards the larger issue of federalism, I digress) There is no law creating a federal standard, which in its own way creates a level of security.

In a PARTISIN PRIMARY ELECTION, most states will have some party identifying mark on the envelope for administrative purposes.

Note: partisan primaries are not always conducted by or for the State, they are largely conducted for the Political Parties to choose a candidate for the general election, often utilizing the States' electoral mechanisms. This also functions as a dress rehearsal for the State. In some cases they are conducted by the party itself. Since Partisan Primaries only allow voters to vote for candidates of their registered party (they physically do not have any other candidates on the ballot) the postal system will simply create a pile of envelopes to deliver to the affiliated party. The identifier is on the envelope in order to keep the ballot secret. For example the mail carrier (whom you assume is democrat) chooses to (put his comfy government job and retirement on the line and) commit an act of mail fraud by discarding or "losing" ballots because he can't stand Trump. Unless Trump failed to make the ballot of that States' general election, it would have made no difference to Biden, because it wasn't for the general election.

IN THE GENERAL ELECTION political parties are not identified on the envelope because all of the ballots go to the supervisor of elections office for counting. There is no need to identify party affiliation on the envelope, it often cost more money to do so and makes all ballots less secure. Additionally, with modern data management, most if not all supervisors of elections will create a unique ID and track the envelope containing the ballot, some State such as Florida will notify automatically, or based on predetermined preference, notify the voter where the envelope containing their ballot is in the system. They utilize the same system that you would use to track a UPS, Fed Ex or USPS package. However even in that case it tracks the envelope not the ballot itself. the envelope is opened in public where reps of both parties can monitor the process. If the mailing envelope has been compromised then the ballot contained with in will be considered "spoiled" or treated as a provisional ballot and then undergo another level of scrutiny ( such as notifying the voter and having them verify and reseal or recast their ballot.)

To your overall point, there is no way to total eliminate bad actors from the process. But one can take precautions such as: checking on the status of their ballot through a tracking system, dropping their ballot directly into the system at the post office. voting early in person, even voting in person on election day. Furthermore the supervisor of elections will also take precautions to ensure the integrity of the vote through auditing, recounts and allowing for judicial challenges before certifying the vote.

Example : FL 2000 Palm beach county, polls indicated an irregularity in voter preference for Pat Buchanan. After further audits, recounts and inquiry it was determined that all votes had been properly counted but they also found a fault in the design of the butterfly ballot and improper maintenance of the voting machine. However, this result highlighted user/ voter error, not partisan or intentional malfeasance. Bush & Gore both utilized the Judicial process to challenge the recount. The prolonged court battle was over the method of the recount, (attempting to count undervote/ overvote (i.e ballots that had some indication of preference but not full indication i.e dimpled or hanging chads) not the cause of the initial problem. This was important because Bush won Florida, and thus the electoral college, by less than 600 votes total. In a 5-4 vote the Supreme Court basically ruled that the State could not create rules to count under/over vote after the election had occurred. The system worked as designed, even if the voters were confused.

 

Watch this;

https://www.ins-dream.com/forum/ind...l-memes-and-quotes.61762/page-120#post-847490

and then search the web. It was on Fox News too. They played a good portion of the tape and then showed that
the WaPo put in a retraction on pages way deep, and small, into a subsequent edition.

The WaPo knew they were misquoting. Another proof of how fake news is real and how today's liberal journalism is
anything but journalism.

 

Regarding the individual tracking issue.
I think an ID number is equivalent to a name. In order to verify authenticy, at some point the name and number are linked.

Regarding the issue of ballot secrecy.
Yes, once seperate they can't be traces back to one another, look at the process. Which takes place in front of multiple officials reping various agencies and rivales. If there is any questions the parties can argue their position in front of an election supervisor who must rule the ballot in or out. Again, just like at the polling station, you can't rule out bad actors, only mitigate their impact.

First, The voters signature is on the envelope, not the actual ballot.
Once the ballot is removed from the envelope and mingled with other ballots there is no identifying markers to link the two (unless the voter spoils the ballot by signing or marking it in some other unauthorized manner; in which case the whole thing is thrown out.)
the process:
Step 1) The signature is verified as the eligible and passed to the next station. This is the last point at which the voter can be notified that there is a problem with their ballot.
Step 2) The envelope is opened and a secrecy envelope containing the ballot is removed. The two are separated, stacked and the secrecy envelope and ballot are passed to the next station which must be physically distanced often in separate rooms.
step 3) The ballot is removed, opened up and placed in a stack which is then counted as a batch. If it is rejected by the scanner it is separated for manual processing. Once processed they are mixed with the other ballots from the election.

This is how the secret ballot is maintained. That why the court mandated the secrecy envelope must be used. It may seem stupid but it's an intrical part of the process. It's also why it takes so dam long to process mail in ballots.

 

You NEED an ID to:

Get a drivers license,
Open a bank account,
Buy any tobacco,
Buy any alcohol,
Buy paint (yes, in many stores),
Purchase firearms,
See your doctor,
Buy a train or plane ticket,
Vote in person in some areas,
Get a passport,
Purchase a car,
Get a loan,
Buy a house,
Rent an apartment,
Get a job (if the employer is law-abiding),
Get utilities (elec, water, etc),
Get Medicare/Medicaid,
Donate blood,
Pawn anything,
Apply to a school,
Etc. Etc. Etc.

What you DON'T NEED an ID for,

Vote for the HIGHEST LEVEL, and the MOST IMPORTANT OFFICE in the USA by mail!

 

Id or Signature it doesn't matter they are equally traceable. However, simply using an ID number would make it easy for someone to vote by proxy. just vote for them and place their ID on it.

Your original assertion was to have each voter tie themselves to their ballot via a Voter ID number so that their ballot could be verified and/or thrown out at some later time. I had 2 points of rebuttal 1) If you do that, then what is the point of a secret ballot? why not just run a caucus? 2) Whats is to stop a law abiding voter from accidentally screwing up their Voter ID # taking out their vote and possibly the vote of someone else as well?

Why do you think a voter ID # would be any more effective in preventing fraud?