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Admit it, Vote by mail is the Superior System

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Affairs' started by hellohello, Sep 17, 2020.

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  1. capu5761

    capu5761 Trusted Member

    The only way we should be allowed to vote is in person, on election day. If you are too lazy to stand in line and cast a ballot then maybe you should not vote. The only way to ensure a fair and unadulterated election is to vote in person, on election day, check their ID, and vote.

    If voter ID is such an issue and you are below the poverty level and only for legal citizens the State should issue you a plain ID card and allow it to be renewed at no cost.

    Saying there is no evidence of fraud with regards to voting by mail with either absentee or universal mail in voting is not the same that is no fraud existing.
     
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  2. Neophyte

    Neophyte Administrator Staff Member

    This is not what the Democrats are saying. The exact words that the Democrats are using is "There is no evidence of widespread fraud, that has a significant effect on an election". Note the use of the words "widespread" and "significant" in their statement. This is to obfuscate their words so that technically it's not a lie, but in all practicality they're lying through their teeth. Because there is tons of evidence of voter fraud, its just that the Democrats don't consider the evidence widespread and significant.
     
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  3. Brutus58

    Brutus58 Trusted.Member

    I hear you. We already had almost 4 years of impeachment only because Trump won. And the premise for the impeachment was Russian collusion ( later found to be a lie ). The Democrats, socialists and the like have already proved that they will stop at nothing to sway the election in their favor.
     
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  4. Brutus58

    Brutus58 Trusted.Member

    Don't forget about alcohol.
     
  5. Dane

    Dane Account Deleted

    For those of us old enough, the Democrats have tried to impeach every Republican president since Nixon. The only exception
    was Gerald Ford, but that's only because the was no real way for him to win a full term after taking over for Nixon.
     
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  6. Neophyte

    Neophyte Administrator Staff Member

     
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  7. hellohello

    hellohello Trusted Member

    The only way people should be able to vote is wherever they want, with security to back it up. Why don't you walk everywhere you go? Because it's inconvenient. Voter IDs and other measures can make voting secure and convenient. There are multiple ways to protect voters privacy and secure their ballot, and voter IDs and signatures alongside other secure, tracable info can give a paper trail to verify and look after. There are innumerable ways to detect fraud with certain sets of information. Voting in person on Election day is not the only way to ensure that it is fair and unadulterated!

    Totally agree with your second paragraph, by the way. It's ridiculous to expect the poor to essentially pay to vote using IDs. It's functionally a loophole around the ban on poll taxes.
     
  8. hellohello

    hellohello Trusted Member

    Voting by mail is not a right, it's a luxury.
     
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  9. pepperwood

    pepperwood Trusted Member

    WA State has voted by mail for decades, with universally mailed ballots to all registered voters, and almost zero fraud. Don't fall prey to the fear-mongering. Voting by mail is quite safe, even with universally-mailed ballots.
     
  10. TriadSibling

    TriadSibling Bro/Sis Enthusiast

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/07/...nearly-100-blank-ballots-prosecutors-say.html

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/new-york-election-ballots-1.5743748

    https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/ohio-county-50000-voters-received-wrong-ballots-73525373

    There's a difference between "fear-mongering" and pointing out a broken system, as well as the people who have the ability to derail the voting process, or at least make it that much more difficult for voters to get counted.
    Maybe it works great in WA, but that's a far cry from normal for the rest of the country.
    I've personally heard a number of people make complaints that they have received ballots for people they don't even know, and I have seen proof of this occurring. That's not an acceptable state of affairs when mail-in voting is being pushed due to the pandemic.
    It's also not out of the question to scrutinize the process, and point out these kinds of reports in the hopes that these issues will be resolved before the election deadlines close. I would argue that it is paramount to the security of this democratic process.
     
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  11. Immortal1

    Immortal1 Trusted Member

    I live in WA State as well and I have been voting by mail as well. My state does a very good job of making sure the voter rolls are up to date, something other states fail at tremendously. Great thing about my state are all the SECURE ballot drop off boxes that are available. No ballot harvesting here, I wouldn't trust that as far as I can throw it. Someone said that there is no evidence of wide spread fraud when it comes to universal mail in voting. Well, to counter that point, there is no evidence that there isn't wide spread fraud either. Listen, every registered voter has the constitutionally given choice to either request a ballot through the mail or voting in person.
     
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  12. Inger

    Inger New Member

    No is not, the potential for corruption is too high. You cannot call it secure if you don't provide an ID for your vote, like in the rest of the world
     
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  13. capu5761

    capu5761 Trusted Member

    Oh I 100% agree with you. They word it in a way so they are telling the truth but the overall message that average person hears is no evidence of fraud vs no evidence of widespread fraud.
     
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  14. justhangingout

    justhangingout Trusted Member

    Voting is NOT a constitutional right - that's a myth. The constitution states that the government cannot deny voting due to race or sex, but there is no overall right to vote. Our elected government is free to place all kinds of restrictions on voting - like denying felons a vote, requiring a photo ID, or theoretically requiring that a voter's taxes are paid up, etc. I think at one point only landowners could vote.
     
  15. Dane

    Dane Account Deleted

    Yep, that's true.
     
  16. Neophyte

    Neophyte Administrator Staff Member

    The Democrats are trying to push through legislation to change all voting, to voting by mail. They are also making it illegal to ask for any form of ID to get a mail-in voting ballot, and no ID or verification in needed on the ballot. You are not allowed to check to see if the ballot was cast by a U.S. citizen, and people can collect any number of ballots to turn in (currently I believe the number is 6 ballots in most places). There will be no validation and no security.
     
  17. Dane

    Dane Account Deleted

    Election by fraud is their formula for winning. Always has been. Well known since the 30's (think Union Bosses and links to the Mob)
    and ready to be proven but not pursued by Nixon when he lost against JFK.

    My mother, a very devout Catholic, who was super prim and puritanical, even said she was glad you couldn't trust any
    politician or political party one iota, was glad the Democrats were better at it than the Republicans because she
    wanted JFK to win, mainly because he was Catholic.
    She said she hated the whole political realm, but the Republicans were too honest for their own good. If they knew how
    to cheat better, Nixon would have been a shoe-in.
     
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  18. Brutus58

    Brutus58 Trusted.Member

    We, United States citizens, don't elect "A" government. We ARE the government. Constitution clearly states that our government is "....for the people, of the people, by the people....". I may have gotten the exact order mixed up. Also we are NOT a democracy, we ARE a republic. We only vote for representitives. They are answerable to us, the people. Not the other way around. We don't work for them, they are OUR employees. We are THEIR bosses. Of course they have brainwashed a great number of people that we are "their" employees. Explains why they are such ego-maniacs. Another very good reason for term limits. Nancy and Maxine should have gone away a LONG time ago. There are many others, I'm just to lazy to list them all.
     
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  19. Dane

    Dane Account Deleted

    Back in the 90s, Democrats Tom Daschle and Maxine Waters were on an interview and they both were talking about why there was so much opposition to their plan to raise the maximum tax rate to 40% on the rich (can't remember exactly who they said the 'rich' were, but I think they said anyone making over $350,000)

    When the interviewer argued with them about such a high rate, Waters answered (I have to paraphrase),
    " I don't see why everyone has a problem with this, we're allowing them to keep 60%!"

    She and he both considered everybody's money as belonging to the the government and "they" are are allowing
    the American people to keep "some of the government's money"!

    THAT'S the major problem with the Democratic Party, the fully believe we work and are here for them.
    They have totally forgotten THEY work for us!
     
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  20. justhangingout

    justhangingout Trusted Member

    Where in my post did I claim we are a democracy? Regardless, I disagree with your assertion that "we ARE the government." That's only true at the local level. At the federal level, I get to vote for only one House representative, but there are 434 others that I had zero say in voting for or against, and they can pass national laws affecting my life. Similarly, I get to vote for only two Senators, with 98 others affecting my life without my consent for them to represent me. The Founders understood this, and as a result they very clearly wanted most of the "power" to reside in individual states rather than the federal government.
     
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